Author Topic: Clutch cushion rings  (Read 508 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline GR400

  • Club Member
  • Port Hacker
  • Posts: 824
  • Age: 59
  • Location: Canterbury, Kent
Clutch cushion rings
« on: February 23, 2021, 11:18:12 AM »
I'm sure this must have been discussed before but I can't find it.

I've seen a few posts recently with people saying they are leaving the rubber rings out when rebuilding clutch.  What are the pro's and con's of leaving them out?
'80 RD400F, restored
'75 RD350B. Not touched for at least 20 years. Next up
'01 ZRX1200R
'01 GSX-R1000 K1

Offline tore

  • Club Member
  • Port Hacker
  • Posts: 804
  • Location: On a two-wheeler
Re: Clutch cushion rings
« Reply #1 on: February 23, 2021, 03:40:14 PM »
I am not sure anyone figured what those are for.
Some claim the clutch perform better without them (no explanation how).
I have mine installed just to because I had a new set when I replaced the clutch.
Tore

Suzuki T20 1969
RD350B (Indonesia) 1975
BMW R1150GS Adv 2004
HVA Roulette 1957
NV 125 1955
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k85mRPqvMbE

Offline D Peacock

  • Club Member
  • Port Hacker
  • Posts: 975
  • Age: 44
  • Location: People's democratic republic of East Yorkshire
Re: Clutch cushion rings
« Reply #2 on: February 23, 2021, 03:47:56 PM »
They make the clutch quieter as the stop the friction plates chattering. I run the XS250 style friction plates which have a bigger friction area (smaller ID) so can't run the cushion rings, however I wouldn't run the standard plates without them.
For speed add lightness!

GSXR1100 - Big boy’s bike
GSXR400RKSP - Track / Race bike
YR5 - 52bhp - Ported RD barrels, 28mm carbs, Mick Abbey pipes, Powerdynamo with Zeeltronic DC controller, premix, Euro CR 6 speed box.
GT200X5 - Bog standard.

Offline 5port

  • Club Member
  • Port Hacker
  • Posts: 9324
Re: Clutch cushion rings
« Reply #3 on: February 23, 2021, 04:53:54 PM »
Hi Dan, is that the XS250C/D/E plates, EBC2279?
Cheers

5port
5port

Offline D Peacock

  • Club Member
  • Port Hacker
  • Posts: 975
  • Age: 44
  • Location: People's democratic republic of East Yorkshire
Re: Clutch cushion rings
« Reply #4 on: February 23, 2021, 06:06:07 PM »
Hi Dan, is that the XS250C/D/E plates, EBC2279?
Cheers

5port

Yep pretty sure that’s the kit. The custom uses a different kit but I’d remember if it was that.
For speed add lightness!

GSXR1100 - Big boy’s bike
GSXR400RKSP - Track / Race bike
YR5 - 52bhp - Ported RD barrels, 28mm carbs, Mick Abbey pipes, Powerdynamo with Zeeltronic DC controller, premix, Euro CR 6 speed box.
GT200X5 - Bog standard.

Offline tore

  • Club Member
  • Port Hacker
  • Posts: 804
  • Location: On a two-wheeler
Re: Clutch cushion rings
« Reply #5 on: February 23, 2021, 08:28:57 PM »
Maybe Ducati should consider such rubbers.

Skickat från min S52 via Tapatalk

Tore

Suzuki T20 1969
RD350B (Indonesia) 1975
BMW R1150GS Adv 2004
HVA Roulette 1957
NV 125 1955
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k85mRPqvMbE

Offline GR400

  • Club Member
  • Port Hacker
  • Posts: 824
  • Age: 59
  • Location: Canterbury, Kent
Re: Clutch cushion rings
« Reply #6 on: February 23, 2021, 10:02:32 PM »
Thanks gents.
I had wondered if deleting the cushion rings maybe allowed the clutch to clamp up tighter and be less likely to slip.  I guess not  :D

 
'80 RD400F, restored
'75 RD350B. Not touched for at least 20 years. Next up
'01 ZRX1200R
'01 GSX-R1000 K1

Offline 5port

  • Club Member
  • Port Hacker
  • Posts: 9324
Re: Clutch cushion rings
« Reply #7 on: February 23, 2021, 10:21:58 PM »
Thanks gents.
I had wondered if deleting the cushion rings maybe allowed the clutch to clamp up tighter and be less likely to slip.  I guess not  :D

I think, if anything, they help separate the plates as the clutch is operated. Yamaha call them cushions and possibly they reduce rattling.  There is space used by the rings that can be used for more friction area, and many similar Yamaha clutches do use that, without rubber cushions.  I use the rubbers in all my RD road clutches but, I have deleted them from the track bike and, I may also try the XS plates with the larger friction area.   :)

5port 
5port

Offline Barnett

  • Club Member
  • Port Hacker
  • Posts: 995
  • Age: 60
  • Location: Emsworth Hants Uk
Re: Clutch cushion rings
« Reply #8 on: February 24, 2021, 11:13:00 AM »
Thanks gents.
I had wondered if deleting the cushion rings maybe allowed the clutch to clamp up tighter and be less likely to slip.  I guess not  :D

I think, if anything, they help separate the plates as the clutch is operated. Yamaha call them cushions and possibly they reduce rattling.  There is space used by the rings that can be used for more friction area, and many similar Yamaha clutches do use that, without rubber cushions.  I use the rubbers in all my RD road clutches but, I have deleted them from the track bike and, I may also try the XS plates with the larger friction area.   :)

5port

+1 yes plate separators helps allow all plates to separate from each other when clutch operated preventing say a pair of lazy plates sticking together and smooths the action between the plates when clutch is released.

Offline vectisitch

  • Club Member
  • Back Lane Scratcher
  • Posts: 487
  • Age: 54
  • Location: Kent
  • If it aint broke, i still try and fix it
Re: Clutch cushion rings
« Reply #9 on: February 24, 2021, 12:42:56 PM »
I just left my old ones out. No problems like that

Offline chrisg.007

  • Forum member
  • Port Hacker
  • Posts: 3728
  • Age: 57
  • Location: Manchester
Re: Clutch cushion rings
« Reply #10 on: February 24, 2021, 12:46:54 PM »
Thanks gents.
I had wondered if deleting the cushion rings maybe allowed the clutch to clamp up tighter and be less likely to slip.  I guess not  :D

I think, if anything, they help separate the plates as the clutch is operated. Yamaha call them cushions and possibly they reduce rattling.  There is space used by the rings that can be used for more friction area, and many similar Yamaha clutches do use that, without rubber cushions.  I use the rubbers in all my RD road clutches but, I have deleted them from the track bike and, I may also try the XS plates with the larger friction area.   :)



5port

I thought that they were there to separate, however I was told that they are there to dampen the clutch effect (whatever that means).
Most of the guys on the LC site have ditched them and have not had any issues.
Growing old is compulsery, growing up is optional.

RD400D
RD250E  350 conversion
Suzuki X7
RD400E
RD350LC  4LO

Offline 5port

  • Club Member
  • Port Hacker
  • Posts: 9324
Re: Clutch cushion rings
« Reply #11 on: February 24, 2021, 01:56:24 PM »

I thought that they were there to separate, however I was told that they are there to dampen the clutch effect (whatever that means).
Most of the guys on the LC site have ditched them and have not had any issues.

Yes, you would guess that they have some effect, Yamaha and other makers use similar on some clutches.  The difference might just be to do with clutch "feel" or similar.  As they help keep the plates apart, you wouldn't think that they help the max clutch grip.  I am happy with them in the standard bike, like almost every standard Yamaha part they put in!   :)

5port
5port

Online Alistair64

  • Club Member
  • Port Hacker
  • Posts: 567
  • Age: 56
  • Location: Daventry
Re: Clutch cushion rings
« Reply #12 on: February 28, 2021, 08:42:45 PM »
If I may offer some input which may help (better late than never).
Agree with all of the above.
On my tuned Powervalve I've left them out.
It seems to make absolutely no difference in terms of noise or plate separation, but helps with possible clutch slipping.
However, on my RD200, it did seem to make the clutch noisier, so I put them back in.
As neither of these experiences apply to your bike, it's probably no help whatsoever!
1982 Candy red RD200DX
1983 Yellow/black RD200DX (resprayed and previously owned by another forum member)
1986 White/red RD350F1 YPVS - owned since 1987...yes, honestly!!

Offline GR400

  • Club Member
  • Port Hacker
  • Posts: 824
  • Age: 59
  • Location: Canterbury, Kent
Re: Clutch cushion rings
« Reply #13 on: March 01, 2021, 02:27:01 PM »
Thanks for input Alistair.  I was interested because I have heard of this being done a fair bit, but I think you're right mainly with LC's.

Now my 400 is run in and can be ridden harder, the clutch sometimes slips momentarily before hooking up on full bore changes. I plan to pull the cover off sometime to see if there is anything obvious wrong, and had wondered if this was a 'mod' worth doing while I was in there.  When I built the engine I fitted stronger springs but could barely move the lever! so put it back to new stock springs.  I might try 3 of each next time.

Another question to all: Could a worn basket with too deep ridges in the fingers also cause my issue - Plates not moving in and out smoothly enough?
« Last Edit: March 01, 2021, 02:34:46 PM by GR400 »
'80 RD400F, restored
'75 RD350B. Not touched for at least 20 years. Next up
'01 ZRX1200R
'01 GSX-R1000 K1

Offline tore

  • Club Member
  • Port Hacker
  • Posts: 804
  • Location: On a two-wheeler
Re: Clutch cushion rings
« Reply #14 on: March 01, 2021, 03:08:21 PM »

Another question to all: Could a worn basket with too deep ridges in the fingers also cause my issue - Plates not moving in and out smoothly enough?
Yes, this is a common issue with RDs.The clutch basket is too soft so ridges appear. Those ridges interfere with the clutch operation
There are a number of aftermarket options made in stronger alloy.
Tore

Suzuki T20 1969
RD350B (Indonesia) 1975
BMW R1150GS Adv 2004
HVA Roulette 1957
NV 125 1955
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k85mRPqvMbE